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How to pay of the FTQ (brainstorm)

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Hoppa61
Traffic Value: $73,032.40453 Netherlands
10 like this post 1 people
20/11/2021 21:52
I have an idea to get rid of the FTQ.

Create a 2nd market with CFP's (CoinFlipPositions)
MTV creates 18.826.800 CFP's and sells each CFP on the market for 1 cent.
These CFP's represent 50% of the income of the coinflip-game on MTV.
With the money that comes in from the initial sell, MTV pays of the FTQ. Not all CFP's have to be sold immediately. FTQ can be paid off as this is happening.
All holders of CFP will receive there share of income from 50% of coinflip-game on MTV (daily / weekly payments?)
If coinflip-game has negative days, that needs to be caught up the next days before next payments are made.
Sellers and buyers market for CFP, same as for RP's.

Let me know what you think.
fraser
Traffic Value: $10,524.3446 Australia
1 like this post 0 people
21/11/2021 00:25
That's a great idea.

I'd be a buyer.
freak300
Traffic Value: $56,564.16117 Germany
1 like this post 0 people
21/11/2021 07:59
I like it
rajaconsult
Traffic Value: $2,925.36626 Germany
1 like this post 0 people
21/11/2021 16:46
Do I understand this in the right manner? I should buy a CFP for 1 cent and get 18 millionth of half the coin flip profit for it?

As of yesterday, Coinflip made $ 2,326 in November. So half of it is $ 1163.
One 18 millionth of that is $ 0.00005 revenue for holding a CFP for 20 days.
It seems to take a long time to get my cent back for the CFP ... ermm

And why should we spend half of the coinflip revenue on repaying the FTQ? I am not an FTQ holder. I'd rather have dividends for it ...cool
Hoppa61
Traffic Value: $73,032.40453 Netherlands
2 like this post 0 people
21/11/2021 17:56
Good questions rajaconsult

In total, coinflip brought more then a million already. If it makes makes $500 a day on average, it will take 2 years for the buyer to receive the amount which he/she paid for the CFP. And then he still holds the CFP. That is a big ROI. The risk ofcourse is that coinflip brings less, but it could also bring more.

And for your dividends. MTV will first pay of the FTQ before it starts paying dividends. Doing this will get you dividends sooner.
jamespaul
Traffic Value: $152,534.85777 United States
0 like this post 0 people
21/11/2021 20:22
I really like this idea.  And MTV could always buy some back in the future.

I would  definitely buy much more than I would otherwise just for the sole reason of helping eliminate the FTQ, resulting in dividends sooner.

And happy to do it with fresh outside money if necessary.
rajaconsult
Traffic Value: $2,925.36626 Germany
0 like this post 0 people
22/11/2021 21:06
>>"MTV will first pay of the FTQ before it starts paying dividends. Doing this will get you dividends sooner."<&lt;

At the moment we use all the revenues (if we had some...) to pay back the FTQ.

At the moment we have no (or low) revenues and cant pay back the FTQ. Thats our problem, right?
Now the user should buy some CFP to pay back the FTQ. Thats OK, the FTQ holders are happy...
But now we have some CFP holders, we cant pay back... (or it will take a long time). And it will take a much more time because we are just using the CoinFlip revenues to pay them back...

If you have 100$ in FTQ. Would you buy CFP for 100$ to pay back your own FTQ?
Hoppa61
Traffic Value: $73,032.40453 Netherlands
1 like this post 0 people
22/11/2021 22:33
The CFP-holders don't need to be paid back. They receive 50% of the CoinFlip-revenues (not all). When they want money back, they can sell there CFP on the market.
When they receive their profit, then they will be playing games, buy more CFP, buy RP's (higher RP-value?) or cashout.
Whatever they will do it will bring more cashflow on the site.
At this moment there is no investment on MTV which gives an immediate return. This brings a low-cost investment chance.

The only negative I can think of is that it will cost MTV a maximum of 50% of CoinFlip-revenues. That is the price to pay to get things rolling again. MTV can buy back CFP at any moment ofcourse.

And to answer your last question, yes I would be a buyer of CFP. And I am a FTQ-holder and I am a RP-holder.
druth8x
Traffic Value: $22,417.44153 United States
1 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 04:01
Thank you for thinking of an idea to clear the FTQ.

You state 18.8MIL Pennies I think you mean 19MIL Pennies (Active Debt: $190,068.00)?

In any case basically you want to raise the capital to pay off the FTQ, one penny at a time

The trouble is, $15K per month (and more) is needed for the basic expenses of the site right now.

Can you see them selling $15K per month in CFP's to make up the loss of revenue from Coin Flip?

Also, I mean, I hope not, but say we sell all the positions (be it over 6 months or 5 years). Has revenue gone up at least 15K per month, otherwise, yet again there is basic expenses to be paid. We all know that there really is no expense to be cut.

Also, just how would the site buy back their CFP? Would the site make offers? Would the holders make their own offers, similar to Marc's Crypto Fund where he is willing to give a ROI from time to time and we can accept or let him keep it and it can go up or down from there?

Maybe, since $15K is a lot, maybe an IOU for every month that they need that money to cover expenses? OFC, Early buyers wanted the bigger piece of the pie, so that could get complicated fast. Maybe fair warning to buyers of CFP, only get a piece of the pie if the profit isn't needed. And, as far as how to give out that, now debt, my best idea: The debt is the number of profit that was actually made on the month the debt occurred. The payback is done whenever there is more revenue than expenses and CFP holders current month. Probably some sort of min revenue otherwise rolled over (not made public to cover loss months).

Overall, it's one form of debt for another, as you have to remember to account for the fact the site actually needs the current CFP profit for basic expenses.

I LOVE the idea of being able to hold a position for profit of an actual product (though that's what RP are for, just they are for the whole site).
Hoppa61
Traffic Value: $73,032.40453 Netherlands
2 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 11:08
The actual debt is $188268. Just add the debt of each single period.
The difference is probably the small debts that MTV already bought, but isn't calculated in the total yet.

Expenses won't go up by $15k per month. The payout is 50% of CoinFlip. When CoinFLip doesn't do well, then the payout is small.
When CoinFlip does do well, then the payout is bigger, but the 50% income for MTV is also bigger.
And the 50% payout is only when all CFP's are sold. In the meantime, MTV will still get the profit of the unsold CFP's.

How would MTV buy back CFP? Well, as I wrote, there will be a market, just like for the RP's. They can, but they don't have to buy back the sold CFP's.

I don't get the whole debt paragraph you talk about. you would make it to complicated. Simply said, the 50% must be distributed (near) realtime.

And no, it's not one form of debt for another. If you want, it is selling future profits of CoinFlip to clear current FTQ-debt. You can see it as a jump into the future.

And yes, I understand that MTV needs a lot for basic expenses. But MTV had a huge debt which they got rid of. And now they are in a situation that al money that comes in is needed.
Something is needed to break through this. When this is implemented you have an extra investment oppurtunity for the MTV members and we are so much closer to having dividends for RP's. Maybe giving a boost to RP-price.

When the CoinFlip-profits are distributed, some of it will be cashed out, but some of it will be used to play games and buy bulk ads or RP's. And more fresh money will come in from people wanting to buy CFP's (or RP's now that the chance of dividends will make them rise).
The same for paying the FTQ-debt. People receiving the FTQ-payment may cashout, but may also use it on the site.
In other words: more cashflow.

Yes, RP's are there to hold a position for profit for the whole site. But the FTQ is at this moment preventing the RP-holders to receive dividends in the foreseeable future.
Vixthra
Traffic Value: $2,179.00664 Slovenia
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 16:25
In any case, these are all-time CF revenue stats we're talking about, yes? That would mean a very fair deal is from the Jo era, and, legit or not, it accounts for A LOT - and in turn, a lot LESS now.
Vixthra
Traffic Value: $2,179.00664 Slovenia
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 16:48
It would however maybe be an intriguing idea for community participation in the whole matter. I would simplify it somewhat though:
-a flat 2.000.000 CFP created for MTV and put on sale at 0,1$ each
- ALL of CF revenue gets credited to CFP owners, which in turn means same funds for MTV if no one buys or ofcourse instant funds if people would buy them
- same principle could maybe be applied for BAP CF?
- a normal market for buying/selling CFP with fees (MTV will hold the block at 0,1$), and the same for BAP if it would be.
- (I would also add refcom to the pot so 100% would get shared to CFP holders, but many of you probably wouldn't like that).
- CFP project could run indefinitely, or, when achieving its purpose or wanting to be terminated, MTV would force-credit all CFP positions back to itself and return at 100% ROI to all that held them - and close the CFP project

So all in all this might be at least an interesting idea, even if not an instant solver. All that would be needed now would be programming time smile
Hoppa61
Traffic Value: $73,032.40453 Netherlands
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 19:42
If you want some figures Vixhtra, these are from last year November 1st until October 31st:
Total Coinflip-revenue is $83644. 50% of that is $41822.
$41822 of $188268 is a ROI of 22,2% year on year.

Average cost for MTV: $3485 a month
Vixthra
Traffic Value: $2,179.00664 Slovenia
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 20:41
Thanks.

Well, it's something. But depends who and why would be interested in it.

At ~0.4% per week it's less than the 1% per week low programs. More however than few % yearly you get for staking or smth, on the more legit options smile
fraser
Traffic Value: $10,524.3446 Australia
0 like this post 0 people
23/11/2021 22:43
This is a great idea Hoppa

Personally, I have about $850 sitting in the FTQ, which I'd happily flip out of there into CFP's.

I'd also be likely to buy more with 'new' money.

With the income from the CFP's I'd either buy more CFP's, RP's or advertising.  MTV could also charge a small commission on the marketplace, compounding the benefits.

So, although that's just a case study of 1, I'm sure there would be many more like me.  It would also bring some much needed energy to MTV and therefore sales in all other products.
druth8x
Traffic Value: $22,417.44153 United States
1 like this post 0 people
24/11/2021 13:40
"Average cost for MTV: $3485 a month"



So, not 15K but $3.5K?


If so, then MAYBE you can get those still on salary to take a small % paycut.
Thing is, they have already been taking paycuts. I don't know if they can pay for rent and food, if we ask them to take another cut. So, then we are asking them to get a 2nd or 3rd job, which leaves less time avl for our sites.


Then, we have to find a way to pay the upfront costs of putting this altogether. I guess that could be a Crowdfunded Project with ROI with terms of a year or RP. Maybe salary reduction can also be a Crowdfund project? I.E. We fund the reduction of salaries to offset the CF Profit revenue that doesn't go to basic expenses?



All in all, SOMETHING needs to be done. At some point just surviving is NOT enough. If there is no signs of ways to improve our situation staying the course, we best just try something, reasonably safe. If it fails, and we die, at least we tried. Those that are making money (salary, mostly) are very few, and they can land on their feet.
fraser
Traffic Value: $10,524.3446 Australia
3 like this post 0 people
25/11/2021 00:01
@Slosumo

Would you consider paying out FTQ amounts owed, if the money could not be withdrawn, but only used for advertising as part of your Black Friday promotion?

You could basically wipe my debt from the total, and I'd give it all back in return for bulk/banner ads.

You'd obviously have to take my word that I wouldn't try to cash it out...but you could of course block the cash out if I did.
slosumo - Administrator
Traffic Value: $28,438.4426 Slovenia
3 like this post 0 people
25/11/2021 07:35
@fraser I'll try to have a think later - got a shit ton to do this week still.

Problem is that it's not just "money spent on ads", but it creates an irreversible path of funds elsewhere (results, ad pool, ref comms...) so it's essentially us making up money to pay you that FTQ, EVEN if you spend it on ads.

What ads would you like to buy - I could check to give you a promo code or manually adjust banner impressions or something.

I definitely won't do this for any amount less than $500, hard to justify the manual time needed.
fraser
Traffic Value: $10,524.3446 Australia
0 like this post 0 people
25/11/2021 08:25
No worries if it's too much hassle.  Just thought it could be a win-win.

I have $824.20 in the FTQ.

I'd split it into:

$41 for 1,000,000 125x125's (1,500,000 with the 50% black friday offer)
and
$783 for Bulk Ads 1,879,200 BAPS (2,442,960 with the 30% black friday offer)

Good luck with the sales event regardless of what you decide.
slosumo - Administrator
Traffic Value: $28,438.4426 Slovenia
3 like this post 0 people
25/11/2021 08:30
Sorry Bulk Ads just is not going to work, as there's no way around "making money up for that" - I can set you up only for any "pure ads".
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